Comments on: The Meaning Trap

By: Mau de Katt

Mau de Katt — Sat, 01 Aug 2009 08:18:32 +0000

Thanks to this post, I’ve been reading all of Deacon Duncan’s demolishments of I Don’t Have Enough FAITH to Be an ATHEIST. And something nigglingly familiar about the authors’ arguments kept cropping up, something about the way they argued. Then one of the authors’ names finally *pinged* — Geisler? As in Norm Geisler?

Yeah, that was him, all right. He’s one of Hank Hanegraaf’s “Christian Research Institute” guys, and he uses Hanegraaf’s argument style as well: “clever” word tricks, rapid-fire repetetive arguments geared to hide the lack of substance behind them, and an overly-smooth, bullying tone of “voice” that is meant to ridicule the opposition merely by comparison and inference.

In short, like Ray Comfort, these folks are nothing more than fast-talking, high-pressure confidence men, trying to fleece the marks convert the unbelievers with a barrage of words and peer-pressure shame.

Pah. I spew them from my mouth.

By: trj

trj — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 18:48:15 +0000

You’re welcome. I haven’t given up on you. Maybe someday you will see the light of reason. It shines upon us harshly, but there is comfort and fulfillment in this ruthless, uncompromising light.

By: Olaf

Olaf — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 17:24:05 +0000

What would be more cool is that if God wrote a bible that could be read by anyone. The letters automatically form to the language of the person reading it now, and it would even compensate for century culture so yje bible would be always up to date.

By: John C

John C — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 15:23:32 +0000

I appreciate you TRJ, at least you interact and keep the dialogue at a high level without devolving into a tit for tat exercise in futility…thank you for that.

It may not “appear” that you and I make any real progress, but the fact that we continue the exchange in spite of our wholly disparate perspectives is, in itself imho a magnificent accomplishment.

Thanks again, all the very best.

By: trj

trj — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 11:05:38 +0000

Would it make you happier if I said “The Bible is evidently a bunch of made-up, antropomorphic crap”?

Part of the evidence being the fact that it doesn’t match reality.

By: JonJon

JonJon — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 06:55:35 +0000

I’m tired of hearing religion equated with a mental illness.

just sayin’

By: John C

John C — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 03:27:48 +0000

The Bible “sounds like”? Perception is everything huh?

By: LRA

LRA — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 03:16:02 +0000

Tower of Babel, anyone?

By: trj

trj — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 03:11:56 +0000

Believe me, I don’t need hidden meanings and ambiguity as excuses. The Bible in general sounds like a bunch of made-up, antropomorphic crap to me, and even if it didn’t its concept of God repels me.

Besides, being the the Galactic Messiah, I know it’s a bunch of lies. Why must you keep doubting Me, John? It pains me to see you fumbling in the dark like this. I am the Galactic Messiah, the Holy Unity, come to bring light and salvation to this galaxy which is a mere atom of My divine Being. Look into your heart, John. See the light before it is too late for you. You know I speak the Truth.

There is more. There is Galaxarius.

By: Aor

Aor — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 02:30:43 +0000

Don’t you have a goat to sacrifice?

By: John C

John C — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 02:26:10 +0000

TRJ…

Ya know, if you keep making up excuses for not knowing (hidden meanings, perceived ambiguity etc) the years will get past you and then you might never know.

No hidden meanings implied. There is more…

By: trj

trj — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 02:18:57 +0000

He he, yes, that was indeed the hidden message. Although, I could just as easily have claimed that the hidden message was something else entirely, like, say, the word “testimony” means something else. That word actually has an archaic meaning: “disapproval”.

So I could really have been saying that the people disapprove of me more than they do of you – which is of course a direct consequence of the Father having sent Me.

Or I could have meant something else entirely, but no matter what I meant it would of course still be in line with the foregone conclusion that I am the Galactic Messiah.

That’s the wonder of hidden meaning and mysticism: You can reinterpret things to make them mean almost whatever you want. In other words: you’re free to make stuff up. For instance, your hidden meanings are different from the hidden meanings Catholics and other mainstream Christians have found. I’m sure you see the problem. And I’m also sure you’ll mention something about light and Truth as a solution to this, which, being just more made-up stuff and platitudes, can safely be ignored.

By: John C

John C — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 01:33:32 +0000

Not sure if you are just messin’ with me or if you’re serious…but if you are referencing that verse (John 5:36) saying “but the testimony which I have is greater than the testimony of John; for the works which the Father has given Me to accomplish– the very works that I do– testify about Me, that the Father has sent Me” impyling that you (TRJ) has a greater testimony than that of John (me) than yes, very clever TRJ, kudos my unvelieving friend.

On the other hand, maybe I’m missing your “hidden message” altogether?

By: trj

trj — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 01:20:54 +0000

I embedded a hidden meaning in my message. If you’re up for the challenge I’d be interested to hear what you think it is.

By: John C

John C — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 00:57:17 +0000

lol, yay…verily indeed. Psst..but the believing is just the appetizer…it gets even better as He saves some (giant and wonderful) secrets for those of us foolish and trusting enough to fully enter in to Sonship, to love.