by Jesse Galef
The Indianapolis Public School system has a policy to ban certain websites from being viewed at school. I certainly hated it when I was in high school (we found ways to bypass it if course) but it’s a reasonable idea. And the list of subjects banned is pretty straightforward: Pornography, Social Networking, Atheism and “Alternative Spirituality”, Games –
Wait, what? Sites on ‘alternative spirituality’ are banned? From the policy (pdf hosted on FFRF website):
“Sites that promote and provide information on religions such as Wicca, Witchcraft or Satanism. Occult Practices, atheistic views, voodoo rituals or other forms of mysticism are represented here… This category includes sites which discuss or deal with paranormal or unexplained events.” [emphasis mine]
Any site addressing LGBT issues or sexual identity is also banned – great idea for the kids going through confusing times, right?
Ok, first of all, I don’t know why “atheistic views” are in the same category as Satanism. But ignoring that idiocy, this is hugely discriminatory. “Normal” religious sites are allowed, but not the “scary minority” religious views. I could understand if all religious sites were banned but there’s no way to justify banning only some.
The Freedom From Religion Foundation is on the case, writing a letter to the superintendent and urging people to voice their concerns.
Offred: I was wondering how long it would be before Daniel or someone posted this, dkos has been having some involved discussions... 
Jerdog: Couldn’t they have at least recycled all that paper? Or will anything tainted with evil 50%... 
Elemenope: Solid, except the “stop the hate” at the end blunts it slightly with corniness. 
bigjohn756: Pathetic… 
Kodie: I found this t-shirt on the same website: http://www.cafepress.com/+anti hate_tshirt,417804848 No real Christian, certainly... 
mikespeir: …it’s only a matter of time before some lunatic tries to act on this “biblical advice.” Yeah. It’s not these... 
DCtouristsANDlocals: Why do people take things to such extremes? I guess it makes for good stories and gets people to watch your... 
77 Comments
Do schools legally have the right to decide which beliefs their students study on school grounds? And what criteria are they using to decide? It sounds like they’re only accepting the few biggest religions, except for Asia’s, and calling the rest “alternative”.
And is there really a reason to use a computer if you can’t play games, browse Facebook, or look up porn?
Oh, there’s no way this stands up to constitutional scrutiny.
Schools have the right to censor anything in their school as far as I know.
No, actually, the schools cannot “censor anything” in their schools. To paraphrase the famous words of a United States Supreme Court Justice (can’t remember which one) kids do not leave their constitutional rights at the school house gates.
They can censor plenty, but basically only if it presents a risk to safety or would be disruptive of the educational mission.
That’s not really true, at least not anymore. The Tinker decision has been basically eroded down to a nub, and practically speaking students do not have the ability to exercise most constitutional rights in school. This has mostly happened because subsequent decisions have interpreted *extremely* broadly the discretion of school officials in determining if a communication or act would “disrupt the educational mission”. We might be seeing the beginnings of a reversal of this “educators are always right” policy with the recent Advil strip search case, but I’m not holding my breath.
To obey the law, they must also ban Christian websites, or they must allow them all.
“but it’s a reasonable idea. ”
Um,
No its not – censorship by the government (aka in public school) is a VERY BAD idea…
Well, it’s just supposed to somehow enforce that kids don’t use it to browse Facebook or play games while they should be studying…
… but yeah, censorship is NOT OK. At all. Much less in a school.
The people setting up these guidelines don’t realize just how ironic they are. The policy, posted online in FFRF’s news release, details what types of sites are to be blocked. Under their own guidelines, their own site should be blocked!
Under Violence/Hate/Racism (p. 3 of the pdf on FFRF’s site: http://ffrf.org/news/2009/ipspolicy.pdf), it says that included in sites that should be blocked are “sites that advocate, depict hostility or aggression toward, or denigrate an individual or group on the basis of race, religion, [etc.]”
Wouldn’t banning only sites related to certain religions be “hostility or aggression” towards those religions?!? Perhaps they realized this contradiction, since the section on exceptions lists “sites that are sponsored by schools, educational facilities [...]”
The banning of sites promoting “atheistic viewpoints” is also troublesome since this means of course that Indianapolis schools would have to ban sites with Bill of Rights, unless they think that the establishment clause promotes only non-mystic, non-atheistic viewpoints.
In my view, for example the blocking of Wiccan sites and thereby blocking much information that would be necessary in forming a properly educational basis is itself a denigration of a specific religion.
Arguably they might be able to uphold the blocking of some atheist sites if they contain commentary that is ‘denigrating’ to religions or religious people. But then in the interest of reasonable fairness they ought to accept complaints about Christian sites too. Christians are no better when it comes to denigrating other faiths or the people holding them (or none). Saying ‘but we love you and God does too’ just doesn’t cut it when you’ve just published a diatribe about the inherently immoral personality of atheists or the ludicrous (in the eyes of many Christians even demonic) belief that Muhammad had contact with an angelic messenger.
A good way to get biased policies rescinded is to turn them against the people who wrote them. Point out the unexplained and evidence-free supernatural claims on Christian sites and protest that these are denigrating and even insulting to your own faith (or lack thereof). Declare that your worldview is based on reason, and therefore unresonable claims based merely on majority opinion and tradition are an assault on your worldview.
Shortsighted as people usually are, they’d probably respond with ‘well then don’t look at those sites’. Which is precisely the same argument that could be made about the sites they are blocking.
Good point. I actually mentioned this in a blog post I did, and you’re right that it may be the thing that will make them rescind the policy since “unexplained events” certainly applies to much of the Bible. I’m hoping FFRF (and others who complain to them) focus on this so that Indianapolis school board realizes how ridiculous the ban is.
If this was a private school, I would have no problem, but it’s amazing how people think public schools aren’t subject to the government regulations every other public service has to follow.
My school does this too. Its stupid and unfair. Because of the blocks, sometimes we cant view sites that we need for our school work. Honestly, no one is going to be fapping to porn in class with their classmates present. Also banned, profanity. Because high school students don’t know anything about that! We also cant view sites listed as “journals and blogs” which is completely ridiculous because they can be an excellent source of information and perspective. I cant understand blocking social networking sites and games, because that would be distracting but they take it way too far.
“Honestly, no one is going to be fapping to porn in class with their classmates present.”
Ha, you’d be surprised. I work in a library and every once in a while we get complaints from patrons using the computers that the person sitting next to them is watching porn. These computers are in open alcoves, not private cubicles. I guess we’re lucky we haven’t had any incidents of indecent exposure yet. But, as a college library that is open to the public, we don’t censor websites– it’s assumed that all users are adults capable of handling adult subjects.
Lots of websites were censored on my public high school’s network. I don’t know about “non-traditional” religious ones (I was not yet in the process of seriously questioning my beliefs), but I remember being so very frustrated when I was supposed to be doing research on censorship in schools and I discovered that most websites about censorship were blocked. Ridiculous.
Gah, sorry, I didn’t mean to italicize the whole darn post.
anonymouse.org is your friend, I think. Proxy browsing for the win ;)
This is atrocious! This cannot be legal.
I think it is reasonable at school to ban pornographic sites and maybe myspace/facebook, but the others make no sense. Of course my old school banned porn, and as a result banned animal sites that mentioned courtship rituals. XP
There is always a bit of the absurd.
Why facebook/myspace?
In my experience, if kids are given the chance to check out Facebook, MySpace, or YouTube, they will never get any real work done during that class period because they’ll spend all of their time goofing off.
In my experience either a kid wants to learn or he/she doesn’t. Boring them to death by taking away things they’d rather be doing simply makes them miserable while they’re not learning.
I dunno, I think Facebook et al can waste the time of otherwise-productive people. Kids who want to learn (adults who want to work…) can be distracted, too.
If they’d “rather be doing something” else they need to be in home school, because they are wasting the teacher’s time and their own. I am a technician for the school district in my county which consists of four schools, and we have to keep myspace and facebook on lockdown not just because of the students, but there will literally be teachers, coaches, and administrators on it all day long.
I hated high school with a passion but letting me get on social networks all day, if I’d had the option, would not have solved my problems.
Maybe I’m missing something, but exactly how much time out of a normal school day is a student actually on a school computer?
@fooby
he means banning stuff like porn and games is a reasonable idea
this form of censorship isn’t used to promote ignorance or indoctrinate children
it’s to make sure the school computers are used for education.
“unexplained events” certainly Christianity is unexplained. Just one example: Eve is born out of Adam’s rib.
Nah, there’s a perfectly logical explanation for that. As I’m sure we all know, the christian god made it happen, and therefore it ought not to be questioned. As usual.
Banning websites on school computers is a legitimate tool to get the kids who don’t know anything about computers to learn how to get around the shoddy school systems, Also when in school children aren’t allowed the same rights as they are when off school grounds, the rights they are denied, as well as any other normally illegal procedures that the school may follow are detailed in that little book they send home every year in the first week and you have to sign (giving away your rights) or you won’t be able to attend public school. If this was covered in that book, the school will be fine and can continue on with their prejudice, I just hope that soon atheists will get our their water fountains and rest rooms as well. And hey while we’re at it, let’s put in separate entrances so ideas can’t mix. gg
wanna send this, can i get a quick proof?
Dr. Eugene G. White,
It has been brought to my attention that your school is blocking various websites for various reasons. In case you may have forgotten,here is your policy:
Sites that promote and provide information on religions such as Wicca, Witchcraft or Satanism. Occult Practices, atheistic views, voodoo rituals or other forms of mysticism are represented here… This category includes sites which discuss or deal with paranormal or unexplained events.
In America, we have the freedom of religion. To block these sites but allow access to other religious sites is %100 outrageous, many people of interest today are atheists, and if a child would like to do a report on them their sources may be drastically limited. Here is a short list of people:
-Lance Armstrong
-Richard Dawkins
-Bill Gates
-Penn Jillette
-Ernest Hemingway
Hopefully you see your unconstitutional ways.
Enjoy your day,
Rob Lewis
%100?
I’d focus on the dichotomy between disallowing content about ‘unexplained or paranormal events’ but not locking out mainstream religion. If they’re Christians, they probably regard their beliefs as factually accurate and historically proven beyond reasonable doubt. Many Christians just accept what apologists tell them, and as we know much of that is deceptive and selectively inaccurate (see McDowell and Strobel, two of the most read and recommended apologists, who have demonstrably quote-mined historians, exaggerated the evidence for the historicity of Jesus, made unfounded leaps of faith in their allegedly ’stringent’ search for the facts, and have made dubious claims about their own biographies and methods of research).
Anyway, if they enforce a policy, they should be able to explain the difference between the claims of, say, resurrection and alien abductions, or more specifically targeting the religious angle (not that there aren’t religions based on alien visitations), like the belief in nature spirits or a Gaia intelligence. If this explanation can not reasonably make clear why one is an issue of education and the other is not – and the select exclusion of one is not a violation of religious freedom – their policy is unconstitutional.
School are supposed to teach kids the subjects they are required to teach and to keep them in a safe environment, NOT worry about all this other stuff like what religion they are or what religions they are exposed to. if the parents trust them to use the internet at school then i am sure anything they see on there like religion they are able to deal with. sure ban porno and other x rated things but for crying out loud any religious sites or sites having to do with religion should be left alone.
Agreed – the school’s job, in conjunction with the parents, is to prepare the child for adult life. While a lot of this may be educationally based, there is also the social aspect to these institutions that will be falling by the wayside if the schools choose to simply ignore these questions. They should also stop trying to protect children from ideas… Ideas are a good thing, even if they turn out to be wrong or inaccurate. They encourage independant thought and intellectual enquiry. Children are not going to ‘turn’ Gay or Lesbian as a result of reading a website.
Questioning the religious teachings they are exposed to every day, though?? Perhaps. But would you be more likely to consider the church and/or the school fair and just if these questions were asked and discussed openly, or if every time you asked about Wikka, Atheism or the Flying Spaghetti Monster/IPU they figuratively stuck their fingers in their ears and chanted ‘Laaa Laaa Laaa’?
We are preparing our children for a life of mediocrity and under-achievement. Maybe we are going to be the first generation who cannot stand to see their offspring out-achieve them. I hope not.
Cjam – UK
This is quite absurd, and I love the points that I AM THE BLOG brought up. But beyond that, banning sites that deal with LGBT issues is absurdly discriminatory. And the fact that this is done in am entire state school system is very alarming. Public schools should not censor the things that these kids are learning. When I was in high school they banned certain sites, such as social networking, game sites, and porn (this included googling certain words, such as breast, which meant you couldn’t look up some recipes in home economics). These things are understandable, as they are rather counterproductive, but kids should be allowed to broaden their horizens, and learn about other religions. By banning this, kids won’t even be able to understand some cultures. I just don’t get why people do these things.
“unexplained events” so walking on water and healing the sick by spitting on them is explained. It really angers me that those of us without imaginary friends are the crazy ones.
Commas are not periods. Learn to make complete sentences.
It’s more or less legal,under voting age and not in court children have very few accepted legal rights, and those they have are often different state to state,and within states they often vary from school district to school district,city to city(as well as towns and townships etc) and considering in some cases particularly in large cities there can be multiple districts,with different rules(also when in school,on school grounds kids have almost no rights even to appeal disciplinary actions by schools or school districts,nor do their parents have such rights in this context,since they “agreed” to the rules of the school,district,and system when they enrolled their child, for example there are multiple cases where children have been expelled for having aspirin,prescription drugs that were prescribed to them, and carrying nail clippers, in the case of the clippers some got thrown out for a year and could not return to the same school.), any student can be searched at random in most places and their bags and lockers checked on a whim, in fact many places you can get drug tested as a student without any probable cause. Unlike adults those under 18 are subject to laws that change state to state,city to city and county to county, Schools often set their own rules for censorship as far as internet goes…and they may have a point on extreme censorship considering that more often than not when children are concerned the kids tend to force ever more censorship and restrictive rules by what they do when they are lightly controlled and monitered as far as internet goes, plus more atheist sites than christian ones have pop ups and links to porn.
Most Christian sites just take you straight to the porn(ographers and peddies) without the need for popups. You had to put that last line in there didn’t ya. Sad.
toolburn I have never seen that,granted I choose not to click on such websites. So you could be right,and/or have a point but we could both be wrong as well.
It is not wise to ban it, since students will now want surely to see what is so forbidden. LOL
“By describing what is forbidden, you have explained what is possible.”
Or something to that effect.
By telling young people that it is forbbidden, then they will want to experience what is so forbidden. They are attracted to the forbidden part.
Maybe there is some elaborate reverse psychology at work here…
… nah.
You’d think they would have learned that whole “forbidden fruit” lesson already…
So do they block access to sites discussing Sharia law?
Sharia Law dictates that:
* adulterers should be stoned to death
* 9-year-old virgins can be married off without their consent to older men
* abuse in not a valid reason for divorce
* women cannot get a divorce without the husband’s consent
* sons inherit twice as much as daughters
* homosexuals should be stoned to death
Ummm. Sorry, but atheists aren’t into those kinds of “Alternative Spirituality”.
This category includes sites which discuss or deal with paranormal or unexplained events.”
Like a son of a virgin magic zombie raising the dead?
Blocking social networking sites is “pretty straightforward”?
Wow…another freedom being removed. It is really sad to see…how are kids supposed to explore or learn when some cultures/beliefs are banned?
In my area, a move like this would certainly have raised kids interest and got the topic rolling.
I have to agree with Elemenope
November 14, 2009 at 3:09 pm
Oh, there’s no way this stands up to constitutional scrutiny.
Seems illegal to me…but I am not very familiar with American Law
Oh I don’t know is this really that bad? Throw in a few of the weirder Christian sects like Joel’s Army, New Apostolic, Reconstructionists, Dominionism, Spiritual mapping, neo-Pentacostalism. Round it off with a prohibition on Creationist and Pro-Life sites. Season with other faith-based sites to taste. Pretty soon you’ve got a workable filter against irrationality and superstition. Soon the kids will be ready to actually learn things.
take a look at an IN license plate dufus – bravo to Indiana – Hallelujah – maybe this will start a trend in this idiotic country that has been kicking God (particularly JESUS) out of the countries schools and producing spiritually decrepit souls like most of Christ bashers basking in the liberal drool they ingested in “school” and now vomit back on sites like this – GO INDIANA!!!
even Putin allowed Bible study in Russian schools – idiots.
You are quite the asset to your team.
Don’t compare Indiana with Russia, compare yourself with Iran. Now you’re talking about progress, baby!
Take a look at New Hampshire license plates. “Live Free or Die.” GO NEW HAMPSHIRE!!!!11!!!!one!!!1!!!
Now please take your toys and leave, so the grownups can talk.
“Take a look at an IN license plate dufus …”
Yeah? They say “Indiana” on them. So?
“Bravo to Indiana – Hallelujah – maybe this will start a trend in this idiotic country that has been kicking God (particularly JESUS) out of the countries schools …”
So God and Jesus aren’t the same? Is Jesus part of Allah, then? Or is he One with the Holy Trinity of Odin and Thor?
“… and producing spiritually decrepit souls like most of [Bible] bashers basking in the [faith-based] drool they ingested in “school” and now vomit back on sites like this.
Fixed that for you.
“Even Putin allowed Bible study in Russian schools – idiot.”
Fixed that too.
Fortunately, batdawg, there’s this thing you guys have called a Constitution. I’ll leave it to you to try and think what that could possibly mean in the current case. You may wish to purchase a motorcycle helmet. It won’t help, but when your head explodes it’ll be less messy.
Oh, and the visor will stop the foam from your lips making unsightly smears on the screen.
That is really f***ed up. Religion is retarded.
I go to a strict Catholic university in the Philippines and they don’t censor atheist web sites. Sure I can’t look up porn on the university network but the wifi signal gets really weak inside the toilets anyways :P
No one complains about schools banning other books…
Instead of trailing off, why not identify what exactly you are referring to.
I don’t know if it has already been brought up but, I noticed that the ruling states; “This category includes sites which discuss or deal with paranormal or unexplained events.” In light of this all religion should be band, as it all deals with “paranormal or unexplained events” If anything ever fit the definition of paranormal It’s God!
you lose most of your constitutional rights when you go to public school. the dress codes, lack of freedom of speech, etc. this is completely legal i would venture to say. i am violently opposed to this censorship but now that i’m out of public school, i don’t worry about it. sigh.
So are science websites considered “atheist”? I sure don’t know many scientists who would consider their research to be Christian, or Buddhist (wait, that’s probably blocked, too).
These people are insane and need to be fought at every opportunity. There is nothing less than an all-out effort by many to turn this into a theocracy.
Wow, what a joke. There is no way this law will stand up in court. Constitution ftw
My first reaction was that someone in that school district needs to start a fuss. Then I realized that I don’t know what the policy is at my childrens’ schools, but I’m willing to bet it’s just as discriminatory, if not more so. Of course, I voted against school uniforms, too, but that didn’t do any good. I guess it’s time for me to go check, and probably start writing letters.
ok well are u gonna get rid of the christian, jew, muslim, and other religious websites?????? Atheism is a religion as well as the others i mentioned. That is breaking the 1st amendment…freedom of religion….that is wrong… i am a proud atheist am i banned from goin to school???
The next time you feel the need to defend your “religion” – which, by the way, is actually a complete LACK of a religion – please try to turn your brain on first.
Remember: the ellipsis is not a suitable substitute for a space between sentences.
This is ridiculous! I’m happy to attend a school that doesn’t block websites related to atheism.
sigh… I remember doing research in school on ancient Greece and not being able to access half of the sites I needed because of ‘nudity’. It was ancient Greek art, not porn!!
The scariest category for banning that I remember was ‘culture.’ Heaven forbid we are exposed to culture in school….
I wonder if godhatesfags.com is allowed.
Are you sure that is what is going on here? It appears to be a list of distinctions between content the filter makes. Is there any actual evidence that it these are actually blocked?
If you google the listing in quotes, you’ll turn up many pages just like that one. Granted, “Blocked Categories” is a poor choice of words.
I feel sorry for you living in such a religious horrible country. There are so many striking similarities between USA and Iran. Good luck in the fight against it!
I feel sorry for you living in such a religious horrible country. There are so many striking similarities between USA and Iran. Good luck in the fight against it!
Two countries dedicated each in their belief to some godhead, while the individuals in each country are growing in natural evolutionary patterns to disregard the mindless myths of lore. Yet the myths persist and the governments refuse to catch up. I saw an internet bumper sticker recently that read: “America – Be nice to us or we’ll bring democracy to your country.”
Yeah, that pretty much sums it up. :-(
I was about to start arguing that Iran wasn’t that similar to the US, but then I thought about it:
1) Religiously zealous government – check,
2) Questionable historical election results – check,
3) Nuclear weapons program – check,
4) Ingrained xenophobia of ignorant masses – check,
5) Death penalty – check,
6) Religious propaganda paraded as nightly news – check,
7) Enormous rich / poor divide – check,
8) Widespread belief in being God’s / Allah’s chosen people – check,
9) Massively corrupt political class – check.
Why does Dick Cheney want a war with Iran? He should be inviting them around for coffee and cakes!
Disgusting Censorship.
“other forms of mysticism” … like creating an entire world from nothing and making man from dust… that kind of mysticism?
I am glad I got out of IPS right after the first year of Eugene White’s Reign of Blindness. I don’t get why children should have to sign over their rights as a human being just to go to school, which is forced by law. I don’t see how it can possibly be constitutional. If you are poor, you are forced to go to the public school system until at least 16 I believe, forced to give up your rights and to be sheltered from anything relating to any other way of life. Some children did not have access to computers at home. I actually had a teacher that constantly threw out bible verses during the middle of class, comparing everything and anything we read to the bible. At this point in time, I was quite unsure of my own beliefs, and I did not appreciate having hers shoved down my throat at every opportunity. Everyone knew about this, and it angered many students, but was anything done about it? No. They didn’t censor and oppress her, but of course… she was over 18 and therefore, constitutionally she was considered a human being and allowed to have rights that we, as students, were denied. Despite this whole “separation of church and state” thing, Christianity still eeks its way into schools, bit by bit, but children cannot even view a website containing atheistic views, or those of any “questionable” forms of religion. It makes me more than a little angry.
I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one religion, under god, with hypocrisy and Christianity for all.
I work at a school in San Diego. There is a web nanny through our server. I’m surprised I can actually see this website! The web nanny censors EVERYTHING. If you want to read an article on health and the word sex is in the article it is blocked. It pretty much blocks everything :(
I love the comments!
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